[dev] [commits] Horde branch master updated. bc5b08ba9bd5b3a0f85bb81687c44c14deee3e89

[Jan Schneider]

Zitat von Michael M Slusarz <slusarz at horde.org>:

> Quoting Michael J Rubinsky <mrubinsk at horde.org>:
>
>> Quoting Michael M Slusarz <slusarz at horde.org>:
>>
>>> Quoting Jan Schneider <jan at horde.org>:
>>>
>>>> Zitat von Michael J Rubinsky <mrubinsk at horde.org>:
>>>>
>>>>> Quoting Michael M Slusarz <slusarz at horde.org>:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Quoting Michael J Rubinsky <mrubinsk at horde.org>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Quoting Michael M Slusarz <slusarz at horde.org>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> commit 6d70e212f68f71369c6d04baa6ee106207aa287d
>>>>>>>> Author: Michael M Slusarz <slusarz at horde.org>
>>>>>>>> Date:   Tue Nov 15 20:18:23 2011 -0700
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> INSTALL tweaks
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> horde/docs/INSTALL |   29 ++++++++++++++---------------
>>>>>>>> 1 files changed, 14 insertions(+), 15 deletions(-)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://git.horde.org/horde-git/-/commit/6d70e212f68f71369c6d04baa6ee106207aa287d
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why the change from /var/www/horde to /var/horde?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Simplifies; also prevents wrapping of at least one example.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's just a placeholder: no need to make it 3 levels deep (I  
>>>>>> toyed with making it just /horde, but figured I would stick  
>>>>>> with 2 levels so it wasn't ambiguous).  There is nothing  
>>>>>> special about /var/www
>>>>>
>>>>> No, nothing special per se, but a lot of distros use this  
>>>>> directory for serving www. IMO, it makes it clearer to the  
>>>>> administrator that this should be a web accessible directory.
>>>>>
>>>>>> - I personally have never seen any installation that serves web  
>>>>>> pages from that directory anyway.
>>>>>
>>>>> Every server I have every used or set up, save for one, serves  
>>>>> web out of that directory - including Horde's various sites. Not  
>>>>> that this makes it definitive, just sayin'...
>>>>
>>>> Yes, that's exactly the reason why I picked this one as an  
>>>> example path. For most distros it's the *real* path.
>>>
>>> Getting a bit off the subject... but in 15+ years of dealing with  
>>> 100's of servers, I honestly can't think of a single time I have  
>>> ever seen /var/www as the path.  So, at a minimum, this disconnect  
>>> between what you believe is the default and what I know indicates  
>>> that /var/www is worthless when it comes to a useful example.
>>
>> I wouldn't say worthless. Most, if not all, of the popular distros  
>> currently use /var/www (or /srv/www in the case of CentOS) for  
>> Apache. I don't remember off-hand, but I'm almost certain that  
>> lightty defaults to this as well. If you compile from sources i.e.,  
>> do not use the packaging, then yes, Apache defaults to  
>> /usr/local/apache2. I hardly think that this warrants calling  
>> /var/www "worthless" as an example. At the very least, the 'www' is  
>> a sure indicator that this is a web accessible directory.
>>
>>  (For the
>>> record, Apache, which runs 65% of all websites, by default serves  
>>> out of /usr/local/apache2/htdocs/dir/).
>>>
>>> As mentioned, I don't really care what we put in here, it just  
>>> can't be as long as the previous /var/www/horde - this name is  
>>> simply overkill for its purpose of being a placeholder.  And, as  
>>> previously mentioned, this lengthy name was causing lines to wrap  
>>> over 80 chars, which make those lines difficult to visually parse  
>>> (not to mention that incorrectly wrapped lines just looks  
>>> tremendously unprofessional - the horde INSTALL document is  
>>> arguably the most important documentation we have; we should do  
>>> everything possible to make sure that document is as neat and  
>>> organized as can be).
>>
>> By the same argument, I would say that it needs to be not only as  
>> neat and organized as possible, but also as *clear* as possible.  
>> Using a directory like '/horde' or '/var/horde', IMO, is not as  
>> clear as using '/var/www/' or even '/usr/local/apache2/htdocs/dir',  
>> though the latter is much too long for an placeholder.
>>
>>> Maybe this is the proper time to decide on an example directory,  
>>> and document in CODING_STANDARDS.  FWIW, I would not mind if we  
>>> simply defaulted to '/horde'.
>>
>> I had thought we already had this, but reading over the docs I do  
>> not see it...so, I agree we should decide and document this.
>
> I guess this is just one of those cases where none of these  
> arguments work for me.  /var/www means nothing to me.  Maybe it does  
> to you, but again - there is nothing special about that directory.   
> That's even more reason to provide a totally made-up directory: so  
> nobody does get mixed signals about what this is supposed to mean.   
> And we **really, really, really** should not be expecting someone to  
> simply drop horde in a directory and expect it to work.
>
> But I have other things to fight about.  But whatever we do, we have  
> to make sure that the channel-discover line is not wrapped on  
> 80-column displays, unlike before.

I already didn't understand this the first time. How is that an issue,  
beside that it doesn't "look good"? In the website version this is not  
an issue, and if you copy and paste it from the console, there will be  
no line breaking in the copied code. I think that's a moot point and  
since this seems to be the driving issue for you we should simply  
revert to the old path.
And by the way, for most users is *is* as simple as dropping Horde  
into a directory, and we've been working hard to get to this point.  
Also, and I think we made this clear by now, even though /var/www  
might not mean anything to you, it does for a good majority of  
administrators.

Jan.

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