[horde] RE: [ALERT] Fatal error: (Apologies)

swap swap at graphic-design.com
Fri Dec 5 04:09:33 PST 2003

Good morning...

I apologize to the list for my rant of yesterday.
Mr. Rostetter, in his calm way, pointed out how silly
the rant was.  But sometimes, something breaks.

   > Oh, I've seen much worse (and much better).

Yes, you're right.  So have I.

Okay... time to learn something...

   > First, there is no such thing as "horde's filters".
   > There are IMP filters, sam (spam assassin) filters,
   > ingo filters.  But not Horde filters.

Wrong term? Maybe? What is it called when you click on
the "Blacklist" button with an email and it takes you
to a page called "Filter Rules" ?

I assumed that was part of Horde since the interface doesn't
change, and it seems to be built in.  Maybe I'm in the wrong
list?  What is "IMP" ?

   >> I've spent hundreds of hours on it with no success.

   > Wow.  That's a lot of hours!
   > You must be working on this at least 8-12 hours a day?

14-16 to be exact.  Sorry I didn't mean "just" on the filters
issue... but rather on email and getting rid of spam

We switched to this email program a little
over a year ago, and with 7 email addresses (various web sites
I administrate for myself or clients) I've been spending an
average of 2 hours per day, 6 days a week just on gathering
and processing email.  My main address averages about 400 to
500 spams each 12 to 14 hours.  The second most used email
address gets 200 to 400 a day. So, you can see, even an
hour a day for a half year yeilds "hundreds".  That's why
I'm beginning to go crazy. I come in to the office at 4:30 am,
and usually don't finish email chores until about 8 am  when
everyone else arrives at the office.

That used to be my precious productive "free" time.
In effect the spammers are stealing roughly 700 hours a year
from me.

About the filters...

   > But any server side filter can be set up independently
   > of Horde and work just fine.  You just need to get the
   > admin to do so.

Oh, if only he would.

   > So it sounds to me like you can use Horde, or your
   > local computer email client, or both.  I don't see anyone
   > forcing you to use Horde.

That's correct. I log into my webmail and the Horde interface
appears.  My local computer email client is Eudora.

I use the Web-based interface through my browser because with
all the spam, gifs, jpgs, trojans, virus and dot-doc
attachments, an email "download" becomes lengthy, and loads
up lots of files to be deleted.  So the web-based gets rid
of the bad stuff and I don't download it.  The new Microsoft
virus averages 150 to 180 K per gulp, and since the middle of
October, they are averaging 30 to 40 a day.

Help? Maybe at last?

   >> I've offered to pay programmers to FIX the darn thing.

   > Usually not needed if you can explain the problem well
   > or show how to reproduce it.


Yes, the "problem" is the Filters work one day, and the next
they don't -- stopping mid-way with "[ALERT] Fatal error:"

This morning I ran it, and out of 300-plus emails it ran
fine, but stopped after filtering about 3-dozen spams.

I looked in the "In" box, and with the top 10 or so spams
were unfiltered ones which I know there's a working filter for.

I experimented:  I copied a line from one of the spams,
clicked on "Blacklist" and it took me to the "Filter Rules"

I put it in.  (I've got 119 filters currently)

I clicked "Filter All Messages"

It returned an empty queue, none filtered, with
[ALERT] Fatal error:

I tried it again. This time with a very popylar spam subject
line.  Maybe 40 or so still in the "IN" box.

Same results.

So it's telling me that once it hits an "error" it cannot
go on no matter how many valid rules, and complying emails
there are.

So I figure It's got to reinitialize.  I log out, quite Explorer,
log back in to "re-launch" Horde (or IMP or whatever it is)...
Click the "Filter All" button... "[ALERT] Fatal error:"

So now, somehow I believe there's an email in there some where
that the program doesn't like.  And that stops it each time.
So out of 16 or so pages of spams left, I delete a few pages
hoping I've killed the bad one and the filters will filter the
rest of the box.  Nope. "[ALERT] Fatal error:"

Tomorrow when I come in, they'll work just fine.

So there's the problem.  And, yes, I can show how to reproduce
it... just click "Filter All Messages" as I've done four, five,
six times a day for the past year.

   >  I don't see anyone forcing you to use Horde.

Yup. You are right.

Except it's the only web interface to my email.
I have no other choice short of switching ISPs and 30 or
so domains to another ISP.  Switching ISPs is no trivial
problem for me.

   > Or just implement some other form of filtering.

If I could, at server level, I would.

   > The US House just passed their anti-spam/anti-porn bill.
   > Now it goes to the Senate.  Maybe it will start your
   > revolution.  Or more likely, it will fail to make
   > any real difference...

Ha! You're telling ME???  I spent the entire summer on Capital
Hill lobbying for strong anti-spam legislation.  Virginia
also passed a really tough bill which kicked in this July.

Most forms of spam in Virginia are a Felony.

Guess what?  Useless. All useless.  We've tried to litigate,
but you can't even get the papers served.  "Not a priority"
sez law enforcement. Total waste of attorney and filing fee
unless you've got some  BIG GUNS like AOL or Microsoft behind you.
And those people are asleep. Legislation against spam is nothing
more but election year schmatta.

Don't tell me!  The Burns-Wyden act is laughable, and actually
makes it easier for the big-business spammers to spam legally.
I've preached and preached but no one listens.  HR-1422 had
far better "teeth" but with politics it ain't the law that's
important it's who you schmooze with.


   > So if you want help from me, you better repost the
   > required info (Horde and Horde application versions,
   > what type of filtering you are talking about, what
   > the exact problem is, etc).

Did the best I could.  How do you find out what version?
I don't see an "About" button anywhere.  Nope, just poked around
and don't see any "version" info anywhere.

What type of filtering?

Don't know.  Just click on the "Blacklist" button and the
screen appears. Doesn't say any brand name or anything, just
looks like the same interface.

Hey, like I said. Maybe I've woofing up the wrong tree.
But the ISP gave me this list and said

   "Go here to find out how the filters work."

So, here I am.  How do the filters work?

Thanks for the help



PS: while writing this email, HORDE has accumulated 66 new spams.

More information about the horde mailing list